First of all, Travis Bickle might be one of the best names of a character in movie history.
The movie was my selection but I don't watch movies the same way many of you do so I'm sure I won't do the initial review justice as I don't watch with an analytical lens too often, replies are more my forte. I shall do my best.
The movie begins and ends with De Niro, masterful doesn't do his performance justice. He is especially strong in the first half of the movie when he is awkward and uncomfortable. He is incredibly believable as the awkward quiet loner who as the viewer you always know is going to explode. The degree of difficulty in playing the 6 out of 10 crazy person is so much more than when he goes full tilt. He's great full tilt too but the whole first half he really pulls you in knowing he will inevitably snap.
Two great scenes in his breakdown- 1st the phone call after the date to the porno theater- I personally found it strange that the camera pans over into an empty hallway during the conversation but knew it had to mean something so I looked it up. Apparently Scorcese has called this shot the most important of the film as he says it's as if we can't bear to watch Travis' pain of rejection.
Second scene that made me think instantly was when he asked advice of veteran cabbie the Wizard. Travis knew he was on the verge and was beginning to worry about himself. Wizard's advice was to basically get out of his own head and accept that everyone is fucked up. Travis of course did the opposite and dove deeper into his own shit. This is also the first time I noticed the other cabbies began to call him Killer. Was this representative of the feelings toward Vietnam during the era or foreshadowing that the other guys knew he was kinda fucked up. Probably both.
This was my second viewing the first being about 2 years ago and I completely forgot that Travis survived and was hailed as a hero. His "cleansing" attack and survival certainly had an impact on his confidence and well being, though he still seemed like he was only marginally better than his awkwardness from the beginning but happier. I'm guessing Travis probably discovered some purpose in his attack and began making vigilante style attacks to clease his filthy city.
My only complaint is it felt like it was slow to get going-alot of quiet driving and introspection, then again I make similar complaints for movies that don't take the time to build on characters.
I didn't even mention Albert Brooks or Cybil Shepherd who were both great in their parts- Cybil used to be pretty hot. I'll give it an A-
Taxi Driver started off on a negative note for me. The very moment in begins the score sounds completely misplaced for me. It felt way to strong, as if somebody was going to get murdered or beaten right away. And I get it, the tension was probably intentional. But, as Sean mentioned, we knew Travis was going to snap. I don't want to know that... I want to be mislead a little bit. Make me believe there's a chance, even through his Vietnam PTSD, insomnia, and sense of entitlement, that he might pull himself away from the 'scum' he continues to visit. But no, we knew exactly where it all was going... the only question was who he was going to end up killing and whether or not he was going out in the same blaze.
ReplyDeleteThe rest of the score seemed pretty on point. I wasn't distracted by it, but at times noticed that it amplified the scene. I think the visuals and direction are fantastic. The views of the city, the streets and people. It helped immerse us in the city that Travis loathed so much. Each view and movement of the camera felt in tune with the scene. With that... I also looked up the scene when Travis was on the phone. I really wonder if anybody really thought, "Ah, cannot watch this rejection!" during the pan away. I took it as more foreshadowing that Travis will be taking his anger to the streets. Even knowing what it is supposed to mean, my take makes more sense to me. Why shouldn't we see in the face of rejection? Should we have to avoid it because he can't handle it? I thought the shot was great, but just saw it through a different lens.
I think the movie does a great job of showing Travis' detachment from people in general. He's never shown being overly chat with any of his fares, his dialogue with Betsy, and his perception of what a good date movie is. They could have gone the easy way his time at war for his behavior, but there was little mention of his service... so it makes me think he's just a lonely insomniac who doesn't know how to react to rejection.. or people/women in general. And, again, the portrayal of this was strong and emotional. He didn't, however, come off as a hero for me. Sure, he rescued a child prostitute from 'Sport,' but he only ended up there because his initial plan fell through. The presidential candidate who had most of Betsy's attention/affection was his first target, but only when he was almost caught during the assassination attempt did he turn his anger toward the 'scum' of the city.
*blaming his time at war...
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ReplyDeleteI'm pretty indifferent on the ending. The shootout itself was well done. Scorcese didn't hold back, and, in Travis' eyes, those he killed got what they deserved. I actually gave a bit of a laugh aloud when they talked of Travis as a hero and showed the paper clippings. I don't at all buy that he discovered anything about himself or the world. I'm guessing the scene with Betsy in the cab wants to give us that implication, but I feel as if he just sees her as another disappoint piece of the that filthy city. Perhaps I'm just not optimistic enough for him.
DeNiro was fantastic in the role and rightfully nominated for multiple awards. All of his dialogue felt right and all of his expressions reflected the right emotions on us. The entire cast was really solid overall, including Scorcese in the cab. The one that really stood out to me was Jodi Foster. She was only 13 and playing her first major film role... and it's a child prostitute across from DeNiro's Travis Bickle. That seems like it'd be a tough role for a A movie veteran, let alone a 13 year old. She was equally fantastic and deserved the accolades that followed.
I feel like there's more i should say, but I'll stop here for now. Despite how negative a lot of that sounds, I did think it was a good movie. Maybe I need to watch it again. The movie definitely looked and felt great... as any iconic movie should. But for things mentioned above, I'm settling on a B+ grade.
Side note... I can't help but think of the current news with the Santa Barbara shootings connected by a lonely man's sense of entitlement, anger and violence. While the difference are clearly vast, there are some similarities. Society wants to blame the current killings on mental illness when it seems a lot more like a clear case of entitlement and misogyny. Seems a point in the movie's favor (especially for the time) that they didn't chalk up Travis' behavior to some mental disorder like people are so quick to do right now in the face of violence.
Can I just write chaotic good for about 5 paragraphs straight? No. Well, then. I guess I shall critique away.
ReplyDeleteBobby mentioned the score. I think (and looked it up to confirm) that is was done for contrast reasons. Slick music set to a disgusting city. I love contrast.
I completely agree with everyone. De Niro was incredible. Good God. If this movie was ourely a character study with no real plot, he would have carried it like Daniel Day-Lewis in There Will be Blood. But this movie has more plot. It has a bit of a purpose. Ultimately, De Niro’s Travis is relatable at one point. He starts of as a guy just looking to work hard and make friends and do right, even if he suks at first dates. (C’mon man, a porno movie? That’s 3rd date material.)
Harvey Keitel nailed it and was pretty jacked considering actors didn't do steroids back then.
Cybil was pretty freaking hot.
No way they let a 13 year old do what Jodie Foster did in this movie today. Unless it was for a reality TV show about children in pageants. Her acting has certainly gotten better over the years. Travis saying to a 13 year “You sell your little pussy” is pretty fucked up. And the entire conversation after is even more fucked up. That scene was uncomfortable as fuck.
At first, I delayed on watching it because I've been busy and didn't have 2 hours. But this movie really coasted by. I think the pacing with watching Bickle drive his taxi to the slick saxophone music set the tone. When he talks over the clips, it's even better. These were not wasted scenes. (The journal entry about days being indistinguishable is fantastic.)
That journal scene leads to the detoxification of Travis. Frightening. This is where his manifesto begins. The shirtless scenes in front of the mirror while drawing guns creeped me out. There are just so incredibly believable. The assholes who shoot up schools probably do this shit. Hell, the asshole who shot Trayvon Martin probably did this shit. I can actually see a few of my Facebook friends doing this shit, but they'd also take the time to fuck their guns. I found it more powerful than the "You talking to me" scene. I also liked the scene of him editing himself. Not enough mass-murders take the time to do so. It shows an eye for quality. Good for him.
Speaking of mental illness, Travis is probably mental ill. Paranoid-delusional or sociopathic or bipolar maybe? He's incredibly high and low and at all times obsessive. Perhaps the bi-polar is started by the PTSD from Vietnam, which isn't mentioned a lot, but was obviously an important part of the backstory. Vietnam was probably in the mind of everyone watching this movie much like 9/11 is the back of all of our minds.
Is the guy a hero? Depends on what reality you live in. I fear that far to many people today would relate to Travis's tactics far too closely. In the real world, he should be treated like the scum he abhors. In a radical and idealistic world of self-righteousness/self-importance and people who believe their own vigilantism is legitimately empowered by circle-jerks of like-minded people, Travis is a hero.
For negatives, I have to say that the non-primary actors left much to be desired, but I think that's part of the times and I'm willing to over look it. Also, they could have used Jim Beaver as the gun salesman in the hotel room. A blown casting call.
In the end, this is an incredibly interesting an well-done movie.It clearly holds up and still applies to our world. It gets a straight A.
"Shoot. That's why they call The Wizard." I'm using that line on all women if Blair ever leaves me.
I wasn't thinking about it during the movie but with your closing line this is all I can think of. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRf_A07Elyw
DeleteAs the resident law-talking-guy, care to comment on the likelihood of Travis going free after his rampage? I feel like he could pretty easily spin it as self-defense, coupled with the end result of a rescued child prostitute. Based on the real-life example of that subway killer Bernie Goetz, I completely bought it that the heroic sheen on his actions would blind people to his many problems, though Phil and Drew feel otherwise.
DeleteThere would likely be something similar to the Goetz case, where some charges about the weapons come into play.
DeleteYeah. There are a lot of ways that he's back on the streets. Jury, plea deal, lax prosecutor. I think most likely its because he's seen as sympathetic. Many people watch Law & Order and see prosecutors as the "good guys" who are out to get justice. Really, a prosecutor's incentives are not linear with justice, rather, it's to throw as many people in jail as possible. Accuracy is not a factor in prosecutorial success. In the end, the prosecutor does work for the public and if the man is popular, she keeps them out of prison.
DeleteI didn’t know a lot about Taxi Driver going in, other than it’s supposedly a classic, it had a great cast & director, and it inspired some nutjob to shoot Ronald Reagan. Ok then. It was a solid pick, and I’m glad I have it in my wheelhouse of movie history to draw on. However, I can’t say I enjoyed my 114 minutes with Mr. Bickle. While De Niro was great and there are plenty of good ideas to grasp, I felt like we ended up with somewhat of a mess of plot that needed to pick a direction but never did.
ReplyDeleteLet’s start with the obvious that everyone has alluded to. De Niro was pretty freaking amazing as Travis Bickle. It’s extremely tough to forget a famous actor is that person when watching a movie. For example, I’ve seen Fast Five and Fast Six, and I couldn’t tell you the name of The Rock’s character. He’s just playing The Rock as some cop. I forgot I was watching Robert De Niro, which is really hard to do. I have to disagree about the rest of the performances though. They were fine. Harvey Keitel was second best in my book. Jodie Foster definitely gets points for difficulty, but that’s where it ends. Compared to something like Glengarry Glen Ross, I thought the rest of the cast was fine but not great.
Bobby hit on the Santa Barbara stuff, and I can’t help but see the parallels. Travis gets rejected after the worst date idea ever, and decides Betsy is in the wrong, not him. And this of course leads to the manifesto and targeting a presidential candidate. Completely bonkers, and terribly unsettling. However, if I were watching this without the knowledge of the Santa Barbara attacks or the Reagan stuff that hangs over the history of this movie, I don’t know if I would have been affected the same way. The only person you really cared about in the scene is Travis, and do you really feel bad, at that point, if he fucks it up and goes down in a hail of gunfire? Of course not. He probably gets what he deserves there.
There are several deeper themes at play here that are interesting enough to consider, but none feel that fleshed out. We get hints at the effects of returning home from war and the effects on mental health, but it’s fairly covert. We could have delved much deeper into the desperate situation of the city and how little politicians truly care about it, but again, only hinted at. We barely even got a fully realized villain, and while I liked Keitel’s performance, he got a character that was pretty one-note.
Instead, we get some sort of amalgamation of a character study with a redemption spin on the very end. I think the story bit off more than it could chew. I rarely think this, but I actually wish it would have been longer, so we could have fully developed some of these subplots rather than showing another shooting at a range montage.
Back to the redemption spin, and the plot in general. In short, half of it was non-sensical. Every interaction between Travis and Betsy seemed unrealistic, until the porn theatre. Travis’s life going back to normal after busting up a whorehouse and getting shot twice… Ok. The end felt wildly disingenuous to me. Crazy people don’t just come to their senses in the blink of an eye, do they? Also, calling the plot slow is giving too much respect to the word slow. We didn’t really get to a meaningful conflict until about 45 minutes in, and I didn’t really care about any of the characters involved other than Travis, and I thought he was a scumbag anyway. A damaged, probably not his fault scumbag, but a scumbag nonetheless.
Last thing: the directing was really good, not surprisingly. I did really like that pan-away shot to the open door during the phone conversation. I took it to mean that the conversation was essentially over, and why drag this on any longer when everyone but Travis knows the door and the street is where he’s going to end up. I think I thought too hard.
I like your thought on the hallway shot
Delete+De Niro
ReplyDelete+Scorsese
+Numerous thought-provoking ideas….
-That were too numerous for the movie’s own good
-Lot of short interactions with characters I ultimately didn’t care about
-A little too non-sensical for a movie that tried to have a message
Grade: B-
Not sure if this it out of turn, but won't have time tomorrow...
ReplyDeleteI really liked this one. I can't analyze specific scenes, scores, or characters that well, but the movie as a whole was intriguing. Phil claims the plot needs some direction, but I appreciated the seemingly randomness in where the movie was going. I had no idea what was going to happen next and I loved it. Much better than most of what we've seen where you could nearly write out what is going to happen 15 minutes in.
All in all, it was a believable, intriguing story about a guy with a mystery mental illness, but it wasn't sad through and through. There was some mystery, suspense, and a touch of action. If this were remade in 2014 we'd all have a frown on our face the whole time instead of a feeling of curiosity.
B+, great pick.
Give the analysis a shot. If it makes sense to you, you can't be wrong.
DeleteAgreed.. I'd like to hear more. If I only read what you wrote here, I would have assumed you were giving this move an A or A+.
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ReplyDeleteThis is going to be long, so bear with me.
ReplyDeleteThe Golden Age of Film lasted from the early 60’s to 1977. I need to learn more about why this was the case, but my very basic understanding of root causes is the breakdown of the stranglehold studios had on what got made, the trashing of the Hayes code, which was a set of censorious rules about what could be depicted onscreen, and the spread of French-style filmmaking to America, a style defined by experimentation and the inclusion of more personal storytelling in films. Star Wars marks the end of the Golden Age not because Star Wars was bad, but because its phenomenal success gave power back to the studios in their hunt for the next big blockbuster.
Why is this important? Because Taxi Driver came out in 1976, a year where 3 of my 26 A+ movies debuted, thus making it the most top-heavy year for quality for me in film history (followed closely by 2007, 1999, and 1994). It’s great for all the reasons the Golden Age was great. It’s unique and boundary-breaking and personal, while also making a big mark on movie history. It seems like it perfectly captures its time while not being dated. It is a Great movie, easily the best one we’ve reviewed so far.
This is the second time I’ve watched Taxi Driver, and since I knew we’d be diving deep into it, I tried to do two things; pay extremely close attention to everything onscreen and really think about its time period. On the latter, the mid-70’s might have been as shitty a time to be an American as any since the Great Depression, though there are definitely similarities to today, which made it easier to fall under the movie’s spell. The fall of Saigon would have happened during production, Nixon would have recently resigned and been pardoned, and NYC was a crime-ridden, polluted, and economically-depressed disaster zone that barely skirted bankruptcy. This isn’t so different from the war, corruption, and deprivation we experience as a nation today, but what I think made the 70’s so much worse was a general pessimism that I think our generation avoids. To live in turbulent times is one thing; to think things are only going to get worse is something else.
Enter Travis Bickle, who yes, has maybe the greatest film name ever. He is uniquely suited to the urban shithole he finds himself in. He says he doesn’t like music or politics; he’s just an empty shell to be filled with resentment and hatred. Geared to wish destruction on anything he perceives as immoral, Travis has plenty to wish destruction on. Phil complained about the lack of context on his military service, but I strongly disagree; there’s exactly enough there. We know he was dishonorably discharged, and in a shot while he’s doing push-ups, we see some pretty serious scars on his back. Putting these two things together, I’m assuming he was discharged because of his injuries sustained during the Vietnam War, a war that was a complete failure. In his mind, he performed a service for ungrateful people, and now all he has to show for it are scars, insomnia, and a jacket. He finds himself judging these ingrates, and wondering why he even bothered. Their lives certainly weren’t worth it.
Bobby wins the discussion so far with his connection of the recent mass murderer with Travis. The murderer has been revealed as a deeply disturbed misogynist who fundamentally misunderstands women and their role in society, much like Travis. This is revealed early on when he hits on the clerk at the porno theater. Of course someone with a job like this likes sex, so I have a right to pester her. I love that he buys a bunch of snacks after he fails. The thought of the Let’s All Go To the Lobby promo coming on before a porn is pretty funny. You all have mentioned the way he reacts to Cybil’s rejection, and it’s spot-on. Something’s clearly wrong with her to say no to me. The way he attempts to woo her all strikes me as pick-up artist bullshit, with his bagging on Albert Brooks’s character to make himself seem superior, plus some negging. Travis would fit in very well on men’s rights Reddit forums and other noxious corners of the Internet. This isn’t fully formed in my head, but I would call his selection of Iris as a project as more about him than the real injustice she’s experiencing. She fills some need he has, and it’s not the need to right a wrong. I need to think more about this, though, and welcome your input.
ReplyDeleteOnce he gives himself over to his insanity, the movie takes a sharp turn into an even darker place. The first-person shots of Bickle holding the gun are amazing and terrifying. I wonder if that’s the first time anyone filmed a shot like that, something we, who have played hundreds of games of Halo, have long gotten used to. In this context, that same shot is just gross. The montage of him getting in shape is like a sick twist on Rocky, which came out the same year and beat Taxi Driver for Best Picture. I’m with Shane on the modeling in the mirror with the gun, as apt a penis metaphor as there has ever been. Travis might’ve failed with Cybil, but look how big this magnum is. It’s worth remembering that he’s doing all this not to shoot up a brothel, but to assassinate a public figure. When we get to the shoot-out itself, it is perfect, from the shock on Travis’s face about the damage the magnum does to that guy’s hand, to how hard it makes killing people seem. Other movies make it look like the easiest thing in the world, while this feels much uglier and real. Iris’s very real horror at what’s happening puts to bed the idea that this is happening for her benefit. She’s going to be damaged by this in much the same way her abuse has damaged her.
In discussing the ending, the use of the unreliable narrator comes into play. The movie is rarely on Travis’s side, and it treats his every thought and action skeptically. I don’t think there’s any reason to think the letter from Iris’s parents should be treated differently. This is pure speculation, but I think Travis’s ‘rescue’ moved Iris from a bad situation back into another bad situation with her parents. There’s no hint of why she ran away, only that she described her home as dead. This implies a backwater town, but the letter reveals that they live in Pittsburgh, hardly the absence of civilization. Coupled with the fact that she ran away and fell into sex work, I don’t automatically think it’s a great thing that Iris is back with her family. That’s half of the ending. The other half is the taxi ride with Cybil. Bobby, my reading of the ending is that you’re absolutely right to be pessimistic about him. After she gets out and Travis drives off, there’s a sting in the soundtrack as he looks into the mirror. An interview I watched with Scorsese put forward the idea that that sting is the reset button, such that the timer is now ticking until he goes off again. It was only luck that kept him from killing Palantine and drove him to rescue Iris. There’s no reason to think everyone will be as lucky next time.
I read on another website that the unreliable narrator comes into play here. I didn't see it. Seemed like everything presented was "factual" if not wildly unbelievable. If we would have learned at the end that we were presented a story from Travis's recollection, that would have certainly been an interesting talking point. the unreliable narrator is my favorite storytelling device, but I didn't see it here.
DeleteSide note: I wish I could make you all play Spec Ops: The Line on 360/PS3. Far and away the most interesting video game story I've ever seen. Kind of ties into this movie well.
Better than The Last of Us?!
DeleteBobby - it's a tough call, but if I were ranking the top stories of this video game generation, they would be, in some order: The Last Of Us, The Walking Dead Season 1, Mass Effect Trilogy, & Spec Ops: The Line. All great for very different reasons, and you really can't go wrong ranking them in any order, but I probably go Spec Ops-Walking Dead-Mass Effect-The Last of Us. The story of Spec Ops will probably stick with me forever. The Last of Us is great, but it meanders a little too much for my taste... it is a collection of many fantastic stories, but the overall narrative is just not as strong as any of the three I put above it.
DeleteAlso, if you're curious about Spec Ops, the gameplay is pretty similar to TLOU in that it's cover-based shooting (no stealth though), you can beat it in a weekend without much issue, and it's pretty cheap on Amazon.
DeleteI haven't p layed TLoU, yet. I don't have a PS3 (will probably find the game cheap and play it elsewhere). I've played WD and ME, though.
DeleteCan we just get more Elder Scrolls (not online) games?!
Or, a Taxi Driver game, where we rid the city of scum, our targets being selected by process of whoever the object of our character's desire talks about. But, you have to actually take fares and do your job, too.
I think you just described Grand Theft Auto
DeleteI'm glad you didn't include GTA in your Side Pieces discussion. The stories in those are nowhere near as good as the writers think they are. Ripoff mob-movie stories at best, which is fine, but when they try to tack shitty philosophizing on it, it all falls apart.
DeleteI don't think the unreliable narrator only applies to events. It works for worldview and perception as well. Everything happens in Taxi Driver as presented, yes, but everything that comes out of Travis's inner monologue is plainly bullshit. He's describing something and putting his interpretation on it, but the viewer is seeing something else.
DeleteAs stated by others, De Niro turns in maybe his best performance (after Rocky and Bullwinkle, of course). I don’t really know what Shane and Phil are talking about with the acting. Foster (who had a very long resume when she filmed this movie) is great, Albert Brooks is fun in his small role, Peter Boyle’s got blue-collar charisma as Wizard, the gun salesmen had a sweaty nervousness that seemed appropriate, and even Scorsese does well in his ugly cameo. The direction is stellar, stuffed with grace notes and subtle metaphors, from the bubbling alka-seltzer to the ominously-framed finger guns that everyone points at Travis. The way Scorsese shoots the aftermath and the aforementioned first-person shots are what are going to stick with me. I prefer his more kinetic, playful work in Goodfellas and Wolf of Wall Street, but this is nothing to sneeze at. The score is evocative of the time period, and is a sharp contrast to Travis’s mental state. Anytime a score can inform the characters, it’s a winner in my book.
ReplyDeleteI’m going to save direct responses for the free-for-all, but suffice it to say, there’s more to talk about. This is definitely in my all-time top 25, probably in my top 15. It works on every level, as entertainment, as literature, as art. A+
This movie is a classic but I have a few problems with it. I am not going to delve into the details like Jon and Bobby did but I want to state my overall disgruntles with the film.
ReplyDeleteThe first problem is that Travis had a terrible time accepting the fact Betsy didn't want to see him. Yeah, they had chemistry and she was a bitch for not giving him a second chance but why spend so much time on that? It seemed like the film's first quarter was spent on Travis' inability to deal with rejection. Could have spent less time to make that point.
Second problem, the glorification of Bickle's violence. He is the vigilante who should not be praised for his murders. So he killed some thugs, big deal? He should not be back at his job; he should be in jail without parole. That, however, does not make a good movie.
Third problem the ending as a whole. When the police catch up to Bickle's killing spree, it was too much like Zack Morris called a time - out and everything stopped. Then he has a nice interchange with Betsy but what was the point of it? To come full circle? It was not that great and annoying.
All in all, it was a good movie. It is a classic and one of DeNiro's and Scorsese's best but I did not feel the greatness Jon proclaims it possessed. Works on every level, Jon? Entertainment? Yes because it is a movie and should be entertaining. Literature? What? No clue from where you got that idea. Art? If you consider DeNiro shaving his head into a mohawk artful, we have completely different definitions of art.
Decent story, good acting, odd interactions, overall entertaining.
Grade: B
How does her not giving him a second make her a bitch? He's not entitledbto it.. a major part of his problem is that he thought he was.
DeleteDidn't say he was entitled to it. Have you ever messed up on a date and wanted a second chance? God knows I have. He tried to do the nice things to make up for it; just couldn't get over the no. He didn't feel entitled, Bobby; he didn't understand why she she no longer wanted to see him because it was never clearly explained.
DeleteThere's messed up on a date, and there's took your date to a porno movie, which she described as deeply insulting and gross. Her disgust should have been enough of a clue that it was never going to happen. His entitlement reveals itself in how he talks about her after. If she won't give him time, then she's a terrible person, just like all the other terrible people.
DeleteWas I the only one who saw him apologize and trying to make it right? I disagree with the entitlement idea. He's clearly messed up in the head and when you deal with people like that, things must be made clear. You want to tell me someone who works on a presidential campaign doesn't know a mental case when she sees one? C'mon. She just hoped he'd get the hint and leave her alone. A person without a mental illness would see and do that. Bickle had no clue. Had she clearly explained to him the deal, he wouldn't have exploded in the office.
DeleteThe viewer can interpret Bickle's date choice as his being unable to read people and a fundamental social problem, but she doesn't know what we know. He's persistent and reasonably charming with her initially, and the first hint that for her that he's mentally ill is that he takes her to the porno theater. Another read on that situation for her is that Travis just wants to fuck her as quick as possible, which is the easier read for a woman as attractive as she is. At that point, the date is over, she clearly ends things, and she's done with him. He can apologize all he wants, but she doesn't owe him anything. She could've explained things to him ad nauseum, but he's incapable of seeing her point of view, so it's pointless. What responsibility does she have to a mentally-ill stalker, who she doesn't even recognize as mentally ill in the first place?
DeleteI think there's too much emphasis on mentally ill. Take that out of it... he still thought people were scum, he was better than most people in the city, and he deserved her attention. It's simple, if she says no, for whatever reason... that's her choice, and it's not a bitch move. He messed up pretty majorly, and definitely felt like he should still have her attention. I thought made it pretty clear when she walked out what the problem was. I'm not even sure she owed him any further explanation anyway. Apologies don't make things go away and don't entitle anybody to a second chance. I keep on using that word... and I think it means what I think it means!
DeleteAnd I think Jon nailed it with "His entitlement reveals itself in how he talks about her after. If she won't give him time, then she's a terrible person, just like all the other terrible people."
DeleteEntertainment is the lowest bar for movie success, but enough movies fall under it that it's worth pointing out when a movie holds my attention continuously throughout.
DeleteTaxi Driver very much works as a literate document, such that it's a descriptive snapshot of a time in history as well as capturing its central character's life and mindset.
I would define art as something that's able to create a complicated emotional response in the consumer, something Taxi Driver very much succeeds at.
You guys are out to lunch on this issue. Jon, if someone explains it clearly, there is little room for the lack of understanding. Any teacher will agree. Does he have to like it? Not at all. He's not entitled to anything but if someone doesn't get it and you ask for advice from a friend about it, the person should say to be clear about it. Why is that seen an entitlement?
DeleteAlso, I never suggested that apologies make everything better. I mentioned it as evidence that he didn't feel entitled to her. If he truly felt that way, he wouldn't have apologized.
What he said afterwards is an example as to how people use to get over things. "Not worth my time" blah blah blah.
Name one person who doesn't think he's better than scum and I'll buy you a corn beef sandwich. Mark David Chapman, the assassin on John Lennon, would say he is better than scum. He claimed that up to his sentencing. That isn't a good example to use.
Jon, your definition of literature describes every 80s movie you cannot stand and the one for art is pretty general.
Plenty of people don't understand things that are explained well... sometimes it's just because they refuse to accept anything other than what they want/believe. Travis is that kind of person. It's not like he was just asking for an explanation. He constantly called her, and then showed up at her work when she didn't respond anymore just to let her that she's the shitty one. How is that not seen as entitlement?
DeleteIf you apologize with only the expectation of getting what you want, it's not much of an apology. Especially if it's followed by anger and rampage. Also, if you resort to name calling or anything of the sort because you didn't get your way.. that's a sense of entitlement, not a simple coping mechanism. Travis has a major sense of entitlement... about women and about the city... he some how thinks he deserves to live in a 'clean' city but none of the people he spends his nights around deserve the same.
When it comes to dating, I could not disagree with you more for reasons aforementioned.
DeleteSo... you're saying everybody deserves a second chance in dating? Do all women deserve the same, even after the worst date scenarios? Regardless of how they messed up or deceived you... especially if it reveals something about the person you do not see yourself compatible with in any way? That seems like a more concrete reason than a 'I just wasn't feeling in' type of line. She's allowed to changer her mind, with or without explanation, about him.
DeleteWe shouldn't have to degrade people to get over things. Women are actually afraid to say no at times because they fear how a guy might react to it.
I guess i should ask... what you think she should have done after the porno date? Why should she have done it? Are you calling her a bitch because just because she didn't give him a second chance, or was there something specific about her attitude/language that brought you to that?
Bobby and I discussed this on Google Chat earlier today and I do not feel like typing it all out again.
DeleteThere are some things, right or wrong, that you just don't recover from. Taking a date to a porno is probably one of those things, especially after she -just- told you she doesn't like those movies.
DeleteAnd how do you remove mental-illness, Bobby? It's a definite factor. How large of a factor it is is debatable, but it's presence remains. Does this mean it's an excuse that absolves Bickle? God no. If anything it's another reason for her to run away. He's mentally ill and makes horrible decisions. We don't -have- to be nice to mentally ill people. In our urgency to be accepting of all peoples, we end up wanting to accept someone for being different because they've had an extra challenge. I think this is garbage. If someone is an annoying drunk bipolar asshole, why the hell would you want to accept them as a friend. That sounds like too much work.
I should also say I went to high school with a guy named Travis Bickle. Kind of funny.
ReplyDeleteDrew's insistence that he should've gotten a 2nd chance with Betsy is confusing to me. In real life he's damn lucky he even got a 1st date- If I'm Albert Brooks' character I am talking Betsy out of it saying- some weirdo off the street walks in and you go out with him alone- you don't know anything about this person he could be a mass murderer for all we know.
ReplyDeleteI think I may not have been clear on my thoughts of the ending- he did seem happier from his actions but I totally agree that it was just a reset as Jon mentioned and only a matter of time before he went on another spree- I think he's moved on from Palentine but his own delusions of his saving Iris being supported by her family, the police, newspapers, etc will only lead to more violence and depravity.
It's bittersweet that this movie was made in the 70s- today we'd probably get a sequel to enjoy/ruin the original
I never insisted; I defended. Just wanted to clear up that idea.
DeleteAdditional comment on the supporting acting that seems to be debated here.
ReplyDeleteJodie Foster as mentioned was great but what made her great was the range she showed within the movie, fear when she first entered the cab, terror during the shootout, awareness when she was trying to do her job and make it with Travis, but best in the diner scene with Travis when she is showing that she is a child with her naiveté and vulnerability.
Albert Brooks was completely believable for me as the weasly guy who crushes on his coworker but will be getting nowhere- loved the tough guy routine when he kicks Travis out of the office and immediately calls for the cop.
Cybil was great too. While Phil saw her interactions with Travis as totally unbelievable I felt like she was a girl desperate for excitement in her life. Sure she gets personally fulfillment from her job and believes in what she does but this mysterious stranger who walks in off the street is very alluring for her and she is tempted to give him a chance no matter how stupid it is and how much her friend protests. This is most evident by their last interaction after the shootout- she sees him in a new light again and how forgiven the porn theater date because of the excitement she feels knowing what Travis has done. The sexual tension in the rearview mirror is on display.
Scorcese gives his best acting performance too- he's just there to continue to provide Travis and example of the scum in the city- Travis relates to this man who is being cheated on and is inspired by his fare's threats to kill the wife and her lover- possibly inspires Travis to choose Palentine as his target as Palentine is the man Betsy the object of his affection has shown to care for.
Interesting thoughts on Betsy. I just felt like we went from point A to point Z in the office in their initial meeting. Nothing about Cybil's performance sold her buying into his pitch while I was watching. I have to admit I was saying "C'MON!" quite a bit while watching any interactions between the two of them.
DeleteLike I said earlier, we know more about Travis's weird behavior at this point than she does. We've seen him eat candy and popcorn in a porno theater, and we've listened to his creepy inner monologue. From only her perspective, he's a good-looking, moderately intense guy who flatters her on something more than just her looks. It doesn't seem strange that she would give him a chance, which he promptly blows when he reveals to her the side of him that we know about.
DeleteThere is a significant portion of women who prefer mysterious or charismatic men. If you're an attractive single young woman, why would you want to date Albert Brooks unless you're looking to settle down? A mysterious guy who flatters you though? Easy choice. One date won't hurt. It'll be exciting even.
ReplyDeleteNothing Betsy does struck me as out of character. 70's De Niro is a good-looking dude, and Bickle is just intense enough on their coffee date to be interesting without crossing the line into dangerous.
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